• From: Hyrule
  • Registered: 2008-01-16
  • Posts: 1,440

themabus wrote:

because you're not being rational, Rocknroms
would this information be neccessary - provide additional characteristics,
it would be inserted, in this case in Additional flag
for example, if there would be
Tetris (Japan) & Tetris (Japan)
by 2 different companies those records could look like:
Tetris (Japan) (Square) & Tetris (Japan) (Enix)
ther's nothing wrong with that, imho

Sorry but the one not rational is you!
I was sarcastic because you suggested again to add stupid long tags. It's obvious that you have to use a company tag if this is the only thing you can find to identify them; it's stupid, or ever worse, to use always company tags, etc.

Again I see other comment about avoiding v.1x, etc. THIS IS CHAOS! And I respect everyone's opinion, but there's a limit to this.
DJoneK, "Alt" is used for "Alternate" when there's no difference at all in edition or else but only some bytes.

themabus wrote:

like, what do you mean 'archived in DB'?
as far as i know no miracle happens when you press 'submit'
what does happen though is record gets added so other people can compare their CDs to this one
as if to the other physical medium

I thought you understood but I was wrong.
When you have "Limited Edition" in DB what the **** do you need to add it to dat name?
Moreover, a lot of CD media were moved from their real case (rental, etc. I did it too for some cds of my collection because they were damaged. Most PS2 discs are the same on Original and other editions, and so on) so how could people really know at 100% if they have a proper edition? And you want to add this bullshit even in dat names?

Instead of asking to remove headers for SS (because of copyrights or other dreams), ask to remove devilish barcodes and other stuff that are not needed for 99% of systems!
There were a lot of good ideas from members and dumpers in General section that even got any reply, but please continue to talk about stupid stuff!

I have nothing agaist you, you had some good ideas and you made great tools for dumping, but please be serious! By the way if you want to go on this way probably I'll made my own dat to avoid stupidity, but I'll never tell a word anymore about how deeper in the hole you'll go with this naming chaos.

My patch requests thread
--------------------------------
  • From: Macondo
  • Registered: 2007-08-21
  • Posts: 966

Sorry but the one not rational is you!
I was sarcastic because you suggested again to add stupid long tags. It's obvious that you have to use a company tag if this is the only thing you can find to identify them; it's stupid, or ever worse, to use always company tags, etc.

not at all am i suggesting to include editions for all records, Rocknroms
no-intro works the way that flags with default values are omitted
so roughly from current 3171 PSX records listed on 64 online-db pages
~6 pages are with edition less records (demos and such)
~5 hold records with various custom editions
~48 are filled with 'Original' edition records
and finally about 5 with Original+Custom
so for PSX about 15-16% (10 pages) of records would get editions listed (other systems would get far less of those)
is that such a horrible sacrifice?
besides if you are concerned about filename length we could use abbreviations like DJoneK have suggested

now let me explain you (again) how it would work
if we return to examples above, current records look like:

NOeL - La Neige (Japan) (Disc 1..3)
NOeL - La Neige (Japan) (Special Edition) (Disc 1..3)
NOeL - La Neige (Bonus CD) (Japan)

NOeL - Not Digital (Japan) (Disc 1..2)
NOeL - Not Digital (Bonus CD) (Japan)

Photo Genic (Japan)
Photo Genic (Japan) (Limited Edition)
Photo Genic (Bonus CD) (Japan)

Dungeon Creator (Japan) (Disc 1) <| let's pretend Original match to this CD
Dungeon Creator (Japan) (Disc 2) (Memory Bank Disc)

how do this syntax describe records?
NOeL - La Neige: 2 different editions and Bonus CD seemingly from Original or maybe both editions
NOeL - Not Digital: 1 edition that comes with Bonus CD most likely
Photo Genic: the same as La Neige
Dungeon Creator: 1 edition

NOeL - La Neige (Japan) (Disc 1..3)
NOeL - La Neige (Japan) (Special Edition) (Disc 1..3)
NOeL - La Neige (Japan) (Special Edition) (Bonus)

NOeL - Not Digital (Japan) (Original, Special Edition) (Disc 1..2)
NOeL - Not Digital (Japan) (Special Edition) (Bonus)

Photo Genic (Japan)
Photo Genic (Japan) (Limited Edition)
Photo Genic (Japan) (Limited Edition) (Bonus)

Dungeon Creator (Japan) (Original, Limited Edition)
Dungeon Creator (Japan) (Limited Edition) (Bonus) (Memory Bank Disc)

so what does this tell?
NOeL - La Neige: 2 editions, from those SE comes with Bonus media
NOeL - Not Digital: 2 editions, they match, but SE comes with additional media
Photo Genic: the same as La Neige
Dungeon Creator: the same as Not Digital

so as i see it with syntax alike db attains more dimensions and functionality
i don't know why but that's what you're incapable to accept
i do indeed keep running into this scheme again and agin - well maybe there is a reason for that
maybe only reason is me just being blind and foolish - please, suggest a better one then
otherwise you just keep telling that you neither want changes nor like current one
and you didn't like previous one either - we could agreed on that as far as i remember

I thought you understood but I was wrong.
When you have "Limited Edition" in DB what the **** do you need to add it to dat name?
Moreover, a lot of CD media were moved from their real case (rental, etc. I did it too for some cds of my collection because they were damaged. Most PS2 discs are the same on Original and other editions, and so on) so how could people really know at 100% if they have a proper edition? And you want to add this bullshit even in dat names?

excues me, Rocknroms, of course, but imho that is solely your problem
you shouldn't be adding unknown CDs to begin with
besides would this information be available in .dat you could sort your stuff out easily

ECMa130 @20091225 :: friidump 0.5.3 :: PSXstuff :: SaturnPrograms :: MyStupidPrograms2 :: MyStupidPrograms

themabus's Website

  • From: Hyrule
  • Registered: 2008-01-16
  • Posts: 1,440

You haven't understand yet that what follows is the shit/chaos:

themabus wrote:

NOeL - Not Digital (Japan) (Original, Special Edition) (Disc 1..2)

themabus wrote:

Dungeon Creator (Japan) (Original, Limited Edition)

And you continue to assert that it's rational.
We already use editions in file names, I'm not so blind and I agree to use them, but if Original and Limited match and you have a Bonus CD only avaible with Limited where's the problem to write it down in the notes in DB? Moreover it seems you haven't already understood that this is a hobby.
So go on if you like but I'm not on your side and I think many other people.

themabus wrote:

I thought you understood but I was wrong.
When you have "Limited Edition" in DB what the **** do you need to add it to dat name?
Moreover, a lot of CD media were moved from their real case (rental, etc. I did it too for some cds of my collection because they were damaged. Most PS2 discs are the same on Original and other editions, and so on) so how could people really know at 100% if they have a proper edition? And you want to add this bullshit even in dat names?

excues me, Rocknroms, of course, but imho that is solely your problem
you shouldn't be adding unknown CDs to begin with
besides would this information be available in .dat you could sort your stuff out easily

If you are so sure that all used CDs we bought have the right case... I don't know where you ever bought stuff.

My patch requests thread
--------------------------------
  • Jackal
  • Moderator (Retired)
  • Offline
  • Registered: 2006-12-23
  • Posts: 4,130

Can you move this discussion tot the appropriate forum plz

  • From: Macondo
  • Registered: 2007-08-21
  • Posts: 966

original topic

And you continue to assert that it's rational.
We already use editions in file names, I'm not so blind and I agree to use them, but if Original and Limited match and you have a Bonus CD only avaible with Limited where's the problem to write it down in the notes in DB? Moreover it seems you haven't already understood that this is a hobby.

why notes? .dat is what everyone is getting - it's what characterizes redump.org - an image of current state of db
besides notes is generally last place where to put anything - it's least accessible field
how do you imagine people could use such information?
-download .dat
-check/rename images of their own CDs
(i would not rename with current naming though and don't see why anyone would be tempted to)
-go on-line and walk through all notes to see what's in there?
stripping output because of omissions in input will not accomplish anything, imho

If you are so sure that all used CDs we bought have the right case... I don't know where you ever bought stuff.

i am. since you can tell PSX Japanese releases by serial (i would guess PS2 too) - that's only place they really work
serial on case == serial on CD = OK

ECMa130 @20091225 :: friidump 0.5.3 :: PSXstuff :: SaturnPrograms :: MyStupidPrograms2 :: MyStupidPrograms

themabus's Website

  • From: Hyrule
  • Registered: 2008-01-16
  • Posts: 1,440

Ok, Themabus! You don't understand and you finished to confirm that the old renaming was better. Weeks ago you said that serials are a problem for Japan PSX. What I have to say again?
Simply tell me "I want to rename games that way because I like it" it's not difficult.

Jackal wrote:

Can you move this discussion tot the appropriate forum plz

This is another great point. I have nothing more to say about "who takes decisions" (sorry but 40% in my world is not majority! Expecially when another 40% (10 + 30) wanted to stay as it was) and what kind of renaming you want. Simply say "We want to go no-intro standard" and nothing else. As today I'll rename my stuff on my own without your dumb ideas (obviously I will submit dumps but I don't want to take any discussion about "null").

My patch requests thread
--------------------------------
  • From: Macondo
  • Registered: 2007-08-21
  • Posts: 966

Ok, Themabus! You don't understand and you finished to confirm that the old renaming was better

no, Rocknroms, i don't believe i ever said that.

Weeks ago you said that serials are a problem for Japan PSX.

and i can confirm that again - for only fraction of records they could make any sense, they were misused
serials and overall separation of records with artificial v1.x and Alt flags having no basis in real life
was by far the worst thing imho
problems with current one could be resolved by inclusion of editions for those cases no-intro convention would not,
or is unclear about
and, well, those Bonus flags need to be addressed
also, imho, shift to no-intro (i.e. different naming) should have been accompanied by updates in code and db structure
(like there should be fields for all of those new flags and db could do more automatically - on it's own)
but that shouldn't be too difficult to fix

if you wonder why i said i wouldn't use current naming - it's because i don't think it's actually transferred to no-intro properly
for instance the's still a lot of those atavistic v1.x & Alt flags left from previous scheme
(like DJoneK i think it is a last resort to use those,
when there are absolutly no other options left with real physical differences to note)
and some flags are misused,
like, imho, it should be (Demo) always, not (Taikenban) or whatever romanized, because it's an flag
it should ease mundane tasks such as separation of demos from full releases
currently it's difficult to accomplish, i.e. this flag does not fulfil it's goal
and if we stick to this it will get increasingly worse,
like you'll need to be linguist or have dictionary with all possible values to spot an 'Demo'
(those are legacy problems from previous naming, not attribute of no-intro, please don't confuse those things)
so those things and problems i mentioned above
and neither did i use previous naming btw

ECMa130 @20091225 :: friidump 0.5.3 :: PSXstuff :: SaturnPrograms :: MyStupidPrograms2 :: MyStupidPrograms

themabus's Website