1 Topic by Rocknroms (edited by Rocknroms 2008-10-08 02:13:11)

  • From: Hyrule
  • Registered: 2008-01-16
  • Posts: 1,440

The following are some considerations and discoveries after dumping more than 200 Saturn discs:

1) Write Offset.

It seems that ring codes have something to do with write offset in the following way:

- when there's a ring code ending with A, B or C the w.offset is always +18

- when there's a ring code ending with C xx the w.offset normally is +0 (By the way in this case we may have many alternatives audio tracks as it seems there was more than one master copy). Some ring codes are missing, by the way in this case w.offset can be also +222 or else (like http://redump.org/disc/1431/ and http://redump.org/disc/2767/).

- when there's a ring code ending with V we can have different values for w.offset, but the most common are +390 and +684.

So the most common w.offset for Saturn discs seems to be +0, +18, +390 and +684

----------------------------------

2) Problems and anomalies in dumping process.

I've dumped all my games both with PerfectRip and EAC (and IsoBuster where's needed) to check and avoid bad tracks dumping.
PerfectRip sometimes gives bad results, the most common are the following:

----------------------------------

A) Data track with errors in log and after checking with CDMage.

Solution 1: Redump data track alone without audio tracks
Solution 2: Slow down reading speed
Solution 3: a- Take bad dump, dump the same data track with Isobuster (subtracting track02 pregap)
b - check bad track with CDMage and import sectors from data track dumped with Isobuster (this is only if someone wants to check it, the data track dumped with IB normally is good).

----------------------------------

B) First audio track (normally "track02") may have garbage in pregap (you can find this if you dump tracks also with EAC as PR doesn't report any dump or C2 error).

If you open the track with an Hex editor you'll find 2 or more -12 bytes- code strings = | 26 48 26 48 26 48 26 48 26 48 26 48 | in the first sectors.

Solution: Simply redump track with EAC.

This problem was found in the following games:

- Bubble Bobble also featuring Rainbow Islands (E) - http://redump.org/disc/3907/
- DecAthlete (J) - http://redump.org/disc/3252/
- Magical Night Dreams - Cotton 2 (J) - http://redump.org/disc/3889/

----------------------------------

C) Wrong "track02" pregap, bigger pregap and so smaller data track and sectors of data in "track02" pregap.

Solution: Forget PR and dump the old way IsoBuster+EAC.

This problem was found in the following games:

- Puyo Puyo Sun (J) - http://redump.org/disc/3766/
- Waku Waku Puyo Puyo Dungeon (J) - http://redump.org/disc/3751/

Moreover the following games have wrong pregap detection both on PR and EAC with a Plextor:

- Panzer Dragoon (J) - http://redump.org/disc/2636/ and http://redump.org/disc/3243/
- SteamGear Mash (J) - http://redump.org/disc/3890/

[s]PS: there are other cases where point A, B and C are mixed.[/s]

----------------------------------

D) No pregap for some tracks in PR, but pregap with EAC.

- PR adds pregap to previous track.

- EAC move one sector to previous track if it finds mode=0x02 sectors (look down for Dremora explanation).

This is the most strange problem found with PR/EAC

Solution: Redump track with 0 pregap with EAC, check subcode (dump CD with CloneCD or Alcohol and open .SUB) with sca for 0x02 mode sectors. If first sector of one of the problematic tracks is 0x02, move this sector to previous track.

Here is the list of dumped games, and tracks pairs, with this problem (there could be many others).

Arcade Gears Vol.3 - Wonder 3 (J) (Track 05-06)
http://redump.org/disc/5057/
SUB ---> T-26107G
Analysis: Track06 first sector is 0x02

Capcom Generation - Dai 3 Shuu Kokoni Rekishi Hajimaru (J) (Track 37-38, 40-41)
http://redump.org/disc/3652/
SUB ---> T-1234G
Analysis: Track38 & Track41 first sector is 0x02

Capcom Generation - Dai 4 Shuu Kokou no Eiyuu (J) (Track 13-14, 29-30)
http://redump.org/disc/3653/
SUB ---> T-1235G
Analysis: Track14 & Track30 first sector is 0x02

Chibi Maruko-Chan no Taisen Puzzledama (J) (Track 01-02)
http://redump.org/disc/3850/
SUB ---> T-9507G
Analysis: Track02 first sector is 0x02. No w.offset changing.

ClockWerx (J) (Track 05-06)
http://redump.org/disc/3669/
SUB ---> iR0b0t's dump
Analysis:

Cyberbots - Fullmetal Madness (J) (Track 21-22)
http://redump.org/disc/3669/
SUB ---> T-1216G
Analysis: Track22 first sector is 0x02
*** TOC Serpentine structure

Digital Pinball - Last Gladiators (J) (Track 61-62, 72-73)
http://redump.org/disc/4944/
SUB ---> T-18901G
Analysis: Track62 first sector is ok and Track73 first sector is 0x02

Dynamite Deka (J) (Track 08-09, 27-28)
http://redump.org/disc/3522/
SUB ---> GS-9122
Analysis: Track09 first sector is 0x02, Track28 first sector is ok.

Fighting Vipers (J) (Track 09-10)
http://redump.org/disc/5063/
SUB ---> GS-9101
Analysis: Track10 first sector is 0x02

Gokujou Parodius Da! Deluxe Pack (J) (Track 2-3)
http://redump.org/disc/3852/
SUB ---> T-9501G
Analysis: Track03 first sector is ok

Gunbird (J) (Track 09-10)
http://redump.org/disc/5018/
SUB ---> T-14402G
Analysis: Track10 first sector is 0x02

Gussun Oyoyo S (J) (Track 09-10, 16-17, 40-41)
http://redump.org/disc/5047/
SUB ---> T-26101G
Analysis: Track10, Track17 & Track41 first sector is 0x02

King of Fighters '96, The (J) (Track 12-13)
http://redump.org/disc/5250/
SUB ---> iR0b0t's dump
Analysis:

Magical Drop 2 (J) (Track 24-25)
http://redump.org/disc/3518/
SUB ---> GS-9104
Analysis: Track25 first sector is 0x02

Mizubaku Daibouken (J) (Track 17-18)
http://redump.org/disc/4948/
SUB ---> T-19910G
Analysis: Track18 first sector is 0x02

O-chan no Oekaki Logic (J) (Track 06-07)
http://redump.org/disc/3315/
SUB ---> p_star's dump
Analysis:

Pastel Muses (J) (Track 12-13)
http://redump.org/disc/5108/
SUB ---> T-30602G
Analysis: Track13 first sector is 0x02

Princess Crown (J) (Track 6-7)
http://redump.org/disc/4901/
SUB ---> T-14418G
Analysis: Track07 first sector is 0x02

Pukunpa - Joshikousei no Houkago... (J) (Track 23-24)
http://redump.org/disc/4910/
SUB ---> T-16802G
Analysis: Track24 first sector is 0x02

Puzzle Bubble 2X (J) (Track 09-10)
http://redump.org/disc/3559/
SUB ---> T-1106G
Analysis: Track10 first sector is 0x02
*** TOC Serpentine structure

Real Bout Garou Densetsu Special (J) (Track 18-19)
http://redump.org/disc/1747/
SUB ---> p_star's & asapy's dump
Analysis:

Samurai Spirits - Amakusa Kourin (J) (Track 15-16)
http://redump.org/disc/3710/
SUB ---> T-3116G
Analysis: Track16 first sector is 0x02

Sega Rally Championship (J) (Track 15-16)
http://redump.org/disc/3227/
SUB ---> GS-9047
Analysis: Track16 first sector is 0x02

Street Fighter Zero (J) (v1.002) (Track 02-03)
http://redump.org/disc/3661/
SUB ---> T-1206G
Analysis: Track03 first sector is 0x02

Street Fighter Zero (J) (v1.002) (Alt) (Track 33-34)
http://redump.org/disc/5263/
SUB ---> T-1206G
Analysis: Track34 first sector is 0x02

Strikers 1945 (J) (Track 1-2)
http://redump.org/disc/4898/
SUB ---> T-14407G
Analysis: Track02 first sector is ok, last sector of data track is 0x02 so here this sector is put at the end of track by EAC.

Tenchi wo Kurau II - Sekiheki no Tatakai (J) (Track 36-37)
http://redump.org/disc/3666/
SUB ---> T-1207G
Analysis: Track37 first sector is 0x02

Thunderhawk 2 - Firestorm (G) (Track 06-07)
http://redump.org/disc/5194/
SUB ---> iR0b0t's dump
Analysis: Serpentine pregap

Tokimeki Memorial Taisen Tokkaedama (J) (Track 12-13)
http://redump.org/disc/3865/
SUB ---> T-9524G
Analysis: Track13 first sector is 0x02

Willy Wombat (J) (Track 10-11)
http://redump.org/disc/4905/
SUB ---> T-14306G
Analysis: Track11 first sector is ok

*** I saw P_star dumped a pair of EU-US games with same strange gaps, with exception of anomalies above, both EAC and PR give the same serpentine pregaps structure.

----------------------------------

3) Games with INDEX > 1

Dark Savior (J) - http://redump.org/disc/5045/ - real cue
Magical Drop (J) - http://redump.org/disc/4206/ - real cue
Monster Slider (J) - http://redump.org/disc/5052/ - real cue
Nanatsu no Hikan (J) (Disc 1) - http://redump.org/disc/5270/ - real cue
Nanatsu no Hikan (J) (Disc 2) - http://redump.org/disc/5271/ - real cue
Nanatsu no Hikan (J) (Disc 3) - http://redump.org/disc/5272/ - real cue
Prikura - Princess Clara Daisakusen (J) - http://redump.org/disc/4916/ - real cue

4) Other games with serpentine pregaps

The games below have serpentine pregap but don't have the problem of point 2.

King of Fighters '95, The (J) (Track 04-05, 11-12, 14-15, 17-18, 20-21, 24-25)
http://redump.org/disc/1874/
SUB ---> T-3101G
Analysis: Actual pauses are exactly 150 sectors, but according to the Q-channel, those pregaps are 149 sectors long.

5) Other anomalies

The games below have only one track with different pregap from 2.00 or 1.74.

Kyutenkai (J)
http://redump.org/disc/3716/
SUB ---> T-1801G
Analysis: Track pregap is really 2.01, please beware that EAC reports 2 sectors more pregap for every track (2.00 ---> 2.02 and 2.01 ---> 2.03).

Whizz (J)
http://redump.org/disc/5164/
SUB ---> T-36102G
Analysis: Seems the opposite of Gunbird, sync errors that put real pregap to 2.02. Subcode reports 2.00, but if you take this pregap the last 2 sectors of data will be void (fffff...) and px_d8 reports sync error while checking w.o. on those sectors. To get a w.o. you have to go back to 2.02. Moreover IsoBuster reports errors while track extraction.

My patch requests thread
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  • From: Omsk, Russia
  • Registered: 2006-12-22
  • Posts: 350

Rocknroms wrote:

The following are some considerations and discoveries after dumping quite 150 Saturn discs:

1) Write Offset.

It seems that ring codes have something to do with write offset in the following way:

- when there's a ring code ending with A, B or C the w.offset is always +18

So the most common w.offset for Saturn discs seems to be +0, +18, +390 and +684

Sometimes sutch CDs come to an end on K and J. WOffset not always +18. Sometimes in garbage it is possible to observe synchro.

Gaps between audiotracks depend from WOffsets.
If on a disk there are no anomalies, that is traced dependence:
WO 0, +18 or +222 ======== Gaps 2.00 sec
WO +390, +684 ========== Gaps 1.74 sec

Thanks Rocknroms, for a long time I wished to write something similar, but stirs lack of knowledge of English language. smile

  • From: Hyrule
  • Registered: 2008-01-16
  • Posts: 1,440

Thanks P_star.

I forget to say that my conclusions are basically on Japanese games. USA and EU games have some more different ring code structures.
So about w.o. = +18 I mean basically Japanese games.

By the way the mean conclusion about SS w.o. is that they are more regular than SCD, PCE and Amiga ones. About this aspect: Dremora could add +18, +390 and +684 as common offsets in the wip disc form if he stands it could be usefull.

I notice now also your conclusion about gaps.

PS: Even my English is not the best around smile

My patch requests thread
--------------------------------
  • From: Hyrule
  • Registered: 2008-01-16
  • Posts: 1,440

About point 2-D also the following Sega CD games have the same PR problem

Puggsy (U) (Track 04-05, 11-12) - http://redump.org/disc/4106/

My patch requests thread
--------------------------------
  • From: Hyrule
  • Registered: 2008-01-16
  • Posts: 1,440

This is the real TOC / CUE of Prikura - Princess Clara Daisakusen (J), detected both by PerfectRip and EAC.

Multiple INDEX are voice effects joined in one track.

I added to the wip the same way of Magical Drop (J) only with INDEX 00 and INDEX 01.

REM Tool: PerfectRip
REM Date & time: 03/10/2008 18.58.16
REM Drive: PLEXTOR DVDR   PX-760A  1.07

CATALOG 0000000000000
FILE "01.- Prikura - Princess Clara Daisakusen (J).track.pcm" BINARY
  TRACK 01 MODE1/2352
    INDEX 01 00:00:00
FILE "02.- Prikura - Princess Clara Daisakusen (J).track.pcm" BINARY
  TRACK 02 AUDIO
    INDEX 00 00:00:00
    INDEX 01 00:02:00
FILE "03.- Prikura - Princess Clara Daisakusen (J).track.pcm" BINARY
  TRACK 03 AUDIO
    INDEX 00 00:00:00
    INDEX 01 00:01:74
FILE "04.- Prikura - Princess Clara Daisakusen (J).track.pcm" BINARY
  TRACK 04 AUDIO
    INDEX 00 00:00:00
    INDEX 01 00:01:74
FILE "05.- Prikura - Princess Clara Daisakusen (J).track.pcm" BINARY
  TRACK 05 AUDIO
    INDEX 00 00:00:00
    INDEX 01 00:01:74
FILE "06.- Prikura - Princess Clara Daisakusen (J).track.pcm" BINARY
  TRACK 06 AUDIO
    INDEX 00 00:00:00
    INDEX 01 00:01:74
FILE "07.- Prikura - Princess Clara Daisakusen (J).track.pcm" BINARY
  TRACK 07 AUDIO
    INDEX 00 00:00:00
    INDEX 01 00:01:74
FILE "08.- Prikura - Princess Clara Daisakusen (J).track.pcm" BINARY
  TRACK 08 AUDIO
    INDEX 00 00:00:00
    INDEX 01 00:01:74
FILE "09.- Prikura - Princess Clara Daisakusen (J).track.pcm" BINARY
  TRACK 09 AUDIO
    INDEX 00 00:00:00
    INDEX 01 00:01:74
FILE "10.- Prikura - Princess Clara Daisakusen (J).track.pcm" BINARY
  TRACK 10 AUDIO
    INDEX 00 00:00:00
    INDEX 01 00:01:74
FILE "11.- Prikura - Princess Clara Daisakusen (J).track.pcm" BINARY
  TRACK 11 AUDIO
    INDEX 00 00:00:00
    INDEX 01 00:01:74
FILE "12.- Prikura - Princess Clara Daisakusen (J).track.pcm" BINARY
  TRACK 12 AUDIO
    INDEX 00 00:00:00
    INDEX 01 00:01:74
FILE "13.- Prikura - Princess Clara Daisakusen (J).track.pcm" BINARY
  TRACK 13 AUDIO
    INDEX 00 00:00:00
    INDEX 01 00:01:74
FILE "14.- Prikura - Princess Clara Daisakusen (J).track.pcm" BINARY
  TRACK 14 AUDIO
    INDEX 00 00:00:00
    INDEX 01 00:01:74
FILE "15.- Prikura - Princess Clara Daisakusen (J).track.pcm" BINARY
  TRACK 15 AUDIO
    INDEX 00 00:00:00
    INDEX 01 00:01:74
FILE "16.- Prikura - Princess Clara Daisakusen (J).track.pcm" BINARY
  TRACK 16 AUDIO
    INDEX 00 00:00:00
    INDEX 01 00:01:74
FILE "17.- Prikura - Princess Clara Daisakusen (J).track.pcm" BINARY
  TRACK 17 AUDIO
    INDEX 00 00:00:00
    INDEX 01 00:01:74
FILE "18.- Prikura - Princess Clara Daisakusen (J).track.pcm" BINARY
  TRACK 18 AUDIO
    INDEX 00 00:00:00
    INDEX 01 00:01:74
FILE "19.- Prikura - Princess Clara Daisakusen (J).track.pcm" BINARY
  TRACK 19 AUDIO
    INDEX 00 00:00:00
    INDEX 01 00:01:74
FILE "20.- Prikura - Princess Clara Daisakusen (J).track.pcm" BINARY
  TRACK 20 AUDIO
    INDEX 00 00:00:00
    INDEX 01 00:01:74
FILE "21.- Prikura - Princess Clara Daisakusen (J).track.pcm" BINARY
  TRACK 21 AUDIO
    INDEX 00 00:00:00
    INDEX 01 00:01:74
FILE "22.- Prikura - Princess Clara Daisakusen (J).track.pcm" BINARY
  TRACK 22 AUDIO
    INDEX 00 00:00:00
    INDEX 01 00:01:74
FILE "23.- Prikura - Princess Clara Daisakusen (J).track.pcm" BINARY
  TRACK 23 AUDIO
    INDEX 00 00:00:00
    INDEX 01 00:01:74
FILE "24.- Prikura - Princess Clara Daisakusen (J).track.pcm" BINARY
  TRACK 24 AUDIO
    INDEX 00 00:00:00
    INDEX 01 00:01:74
    INDEX 02 00:04:52
    INDEX 03 00:07:57
    INDEX 04 00:12:10
    INDEX 05 00:15:34
    INDEX 06 00:18:57
    INDEX 07 00:22:05
    INDEX 08 00:25:27
    INDEX 09 00:29:55
    INDEX 10 00:32:60
FILE "25.- Prikura - Princess Clara Daisakusen (J).track.pcm" BINARY
  TRACK 25 AUDIO
    INDEX 00 00:00:00
    INDEX 01 00:01:74
    INDEX 02 00:06:73
    INDEX 03 00:16:27
    INDEX 04 00:20:37
    INDEX 05 00:32:25
    INDEX 06 00:36:53
    INDEX 07 00:40:21
    INDEX 08 00:45:15
    INDEX 09 00:49:50
    INDEX 10 00:54:19
    INDEX 11 00:57:42
    INDEX 12 01:00:55
    INDEX 13 01:10:03
    INDEX 14 01:13:36
    INDEX 15 01:16:69
    INDEX 16 01:22:26
FILE "26.- Prikura - Princess Clara Daisakusen (J).track.pcm" BINARY
  TRACK 26 AUDIO
    INDEX 00 00:00:00
    INDEX 01 00:01:74
    INDEX 02 00:07:65
    INDEX 03 00:17:62
    INDEX 04 00:27:24
    INDEX 05 00:33:42
    INDEX 06 00:40:52
    INDEX 07 00:45:47
    INDEX 08 00:49:22
    INDEX 09 00:55:06
    INDEX 10 00:59:10
    INDEX 11 01:02:73
    INDEX 12 01:07:56
    INDEX 13 01:13:29
    INDEX 14 01:20:22
FILE "27.- Prikura - Princess Clara Daisakusen (J).track.pcm" BINARY
  TRACK 27 AUDIO
    INDEX 00 00:00:00
    INDEX 01 00:01:74
    INDEX 02 00:08:16
    INDEX 03 00:12:45
    INDEX 04 00:18:22
    INDEX 05 00:21:18
    INDEX 06 00:26:37
    INDEX 07 00:30:32
    INDEX 08 00:33:35
    INDEX 09 00:37:47
FILE "28.- Prikura - Princess Clara Daisakusen (J).track.pcm" BINARY
  TRACK 28 AUDIO
    INDEX 00 00:00:00
    INDEX 01 00:01:74
    INDEX 02 00:05:29
    INDEX 03 00:12:41
    INDEX 04 00:15:64
    INDEX 05 00:24:67
    INDEX 06 00:28:61
    INDEX 07 00:32:60
    INDEX 08 00:35:70
    INDEX 09 00:43:46
    INDEX 10 00:47:74
    INDEX 11 00:53:61
    INDEX 12 00:59:33
    INDEX 13 01:05:67
    INDEX 14 01:11:20
    INDEX 15 01:18:56
    INDEX 16 01:21:69
    INDEX 17 01:26:66
    INDEX 18 01:31:26
    INDEX 19 01:38:23
    INDEX 20 01:42:32
    INDEX 21 01:48:05
    INDEX 22 01:52:66
    INDEX 23 01:58:45
FILE "29.- Prikura - Princess Clara Daisakusen (J).track.pcm" BINARY
  TRACK 29 AUDIO
    INDEX 00 00:00:00
    INDEX 01 00:01:74
    INDEX 02 00:09:26
    INDEX 03 00:14:08
    INDEX 04 00:22:30
    INDEX 05 00:24:60
    INDEX 06 00:30:09
    INDEX 07 00:35:15
FILE "30.- Prikura - Princess Clara Daisakusen (J).track.pcm" BINARY
  TRACK 30 AUDIO
    INDEX 00 00:00:00
    INDEX 01 00:01:74
    INDEX 02 00:10:04
    INDEX 03 00:16:14
    INDEX 04 00:20:48
    INDEX 05 00:29:04
    INDEX 06 00:34:27
    INDEX 07 00:42:20
FILE "31.- Prikura - Princess Clara Daisakusen (J).track.pcm" BINARY
  TRACK 31 AUDIO
    INDEX 00 00:00:00
    INDEX 01 00:01:74
    INDEX 02 00:10:67
    INDEX 03 00:16:40
    INDEX 04 00:19:56
    INDEX 05 00:27:27
    INDEX 06 00:30:56
FILE "32.- Prikura - Princess Clara Daisakusen (J).track.pcm" BINARY
  TRACK 32 AUDIO
    INDEX 00 00:00:00
    INDEX 01 00:01:74
    INDEX 02 00:11:35
    INDEX 03 00:15:36
    INDEX 04 00:25:65
    INDEX 05 00:31:69
    INDEX 06 00:35:40
    INDEX 07 00:42:67
My patch requests thread
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  • Jackal
  • Moderator (Retired)
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  • Registered: 2006-12-23
  • Posts: 4,132

I'm glad you're investigating this. As far as I can guess there are still plenty of other unneccesary dupes in the db that should be identical if dumped properly.

I hope Dremora can make you a moderator so that you can add the dumps and fixes yourself, because I don't know if anyone else is doing it. Just make sure you remove the dump comments from the comments field smile

7 Reply by Rocknroms (edited by Rocknroms 2008-10-05 11:32:49)

  • From: Hyrule
  • Registered: 2008-01-16
  • Posts: 1,440

Vigi wrote:

I'm glad you're investigating this. As far as I can guess there are still plenty of other unneccesary dupes in the db that should be identical if dumped properly.

I hope Dremora can make you a moderator so that you can add the dumps and fixes yourself, because I don't know if anyone else is doing it. Just make sure you remove the dump comments from the comments field smile

Thanks Vigi for your feedback! I will be glad to be. smile
About comment I added in comment field it was to help a new dumper to understand what's the matter. I'll add these informations in this thread and when I'll have some free time I could make a faq about SS dumping.
After I'll finish to dump all my SS disc I'll upload SUB for the disc with PR pregap detection problem (I was wondering if this happens for a mastering error, or this may be factory setting, that add 1 sector of pregap to tracks affected by).
Thanks!

My patch requests thread
--------------------------------
  • Registered: 2006-12-24
  • Posts: 3,847

Rocknroms wrote:

As soon as I have time and will I'll take subs for all the games above.

So, could you do them? I've already explained you, why most of them (if not all) are dumped wrong.

  • From: Hyrule
  • Registered: 2008-01-16
  • Posts: 1,440

Yes, I'll do them as soon as possible. Sorry but I'm busy in these days.
By the way you explained me the EAN issue, but not WHY (I'm not a zombie big_smile) I have to move sectors... as I said this has to be discussed (there are similar sectors even in the middle of the pregap, look at Gunbird for example (http://www.rocknroms.net/subs/T-14402G.rar).

PS: I had thought the same "moving sectors" of you since the beginning of my dumps, but I need a confirmed matter.

PS2: Games like Cyberbots and Puzzle Bubble will have only interested tracks to be moved in sectors, other track are like this 100%... serpentine.

My patch requests thread
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  • Registered: 2006-12-24
  • Posts: 3,847

Because EAC counts that EAN sector as the first sector of the next track's pregap, but it's wrong.

  • From: London, UK
  • Registered: 2006-12-21
  • Posts: 285

Sectors with mode=0x02 don't have any info about current MSF, track or index numbers (only EAN and CRC-16), so if such sector appears between track n and track n+1, it can be considered by the software as belonging to either of the two tracks. The real sector where the new track starts should be the last one with zeroes in channel P (pause) for the most of the discs.

Dremora's Website

  • From: Hyrule
  • Registered: 2008-01-16
  • Posts: 1,440

I'll try to make all subs tomorrow. Dremora's explanation puts away any doubt I had, all tracks with this pregap have to be fixed (by the way only the ones that have this pregap on EAC and "0" pregap on PerfectRip, all the other ones - see Cyberbots - have no 0x02 sectors).

My patch requests thread
--------------------------------
  • Registered: 2006-12-24
  • Posts: 3,847

So, what's about the subs? Would be nice to fix these dumps, as db is in working state again.

  • From: Hyrule
  • Registered: 2008-01-16
  • Posts: 1,440

I'm working on them in these hours

My patch requests thread
--------------------------------
  • From: Hyrule
  • Registered: 2008-01-16
  • Posts: 1,440

I've added more than half SUBs, I'll finish tomorrow along with checksum corrections (I'm cleaning and finish some catalougation issues within sub extraction... erh I'm also having a life!:cool:)

I'll made also some corrections and addictions at the first post, meanwhile:

F1ReB4LL ---> IPF etc. is not part of ring code. Moreover can you post real cues for INDEX>1 discs you dumped. And have you found some discs with same EAC/PR problem as above? If yes please report tracks affected and SUB if you can for archiving everything for future dumpers.

IR0b0t ---> Can you post your King of Fighters '96, The (J) SUB always for archiving?

TiA

My patch requests thread
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  • iR0b0t
  • iR0b0t
  • Administrator
  • Offline
  • From: Research equipment
  • Registered: 2008-02-21
  • Posts: 6,703

will post the SUBs ASAP for all my problematic dumps

PX-760A (+30), PX-W4824TA (+98), GSA-H42L (+667), GDR-8164B (+102), SH-D162D (+6), SOHD-167T (+12)
  • Registered: 2006-12-24
  • Posts: 3,847

Rocknroms wrote:

F1ReB4LL ---> IPF etc. is not part of ring code.

Even if it's not a part of the CD serial, it is the part of the ringcode, so it must be preserved. I'd like to see even those laser-burned digits, which are pretty common there.

Fighting Vipers (J) (Track 09-10)
http://redump.org/disc/5063/
SUB ---> GS-9101
Analysis: Track10 first sector is 0x02

Street Fighter Zero (J) (Track 33-34)
http://redump.org/disc/5263/
SUB ---> T-1206G
Analysis: Track34 first sector is 0x02

Nanatsu no Hikan (J) (Disc 1) - http://redump.org/disc/5270/ - real cue
Nanatsu no Hikan (J) (Disc 2) - http://redump.org/disc/5271/ - real cue
Nanatsu no Hikan (J) (Disc 3) - http://redump.org/disc/5272/ - real cue

  • From: Hyrule
  • Registered: 2008-01-16
  • Posts: 1,440

All games in DB fixed.

F1ReB4LL, thanks for addictions.
About IFPI, this is not part of ring code. Along with laser-burned digits you mentioned is part of barcode of IFPI that has nothing to do with Sega and/or Saturn, it has to do with the media type and mastering copyrights (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IFPI). You can find this code on every CD-ROM (audio, data, games, etc.); if you look carefully it's written in every SS cd, in some is inside the ring code space with same characters (the ones you preserved), in other is inside with smaller characters and in others is in inner ring or on the other side of the ring. Moreover if you look at the central rings you will find another IFPI code.
I don't say that it has not to be preserved (why it has to be?), but it's not part of ring code. I know Satakore put everything in the same code (by the way calling it "matrix", as used for audio CDs), but that is not the Bible.

IR0b0ts, ok!

My patch requests thread
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  • Registered: 2006-12-24
  • Posts: 3,847

Rocknroms wrote:

About IFPI, this is not part of ring code.

It is. As I've said, it is a part of the ringcode, but it's not a part of the CD serial. Most of other CDs have their ringcodes preserved fully (like those "Masterd by Nimbus" signs and laser-burned "1:1"), and the database should be solid, with the same requirements for every system and every CD.

  • From: Hyrule
  • Registered: 2008-01-16
  • Posts: 1,440

I have forgotten this

Chibi Maruko-Chan no Taisen Puzzledama (J) (Track 01-02)
http://redump.org/disc/3850/
SUB ---> T-9507G
Analysis: Track02 first sector is 0x02. No w.offset changing.

About IFPI we can discuss all year, it's not part of ring code because of what I said in the previous post. I repeat... this code can be found also in inner rings or in opposite side of the real ring code. Serial has nothing to do with ring code. Ring code + IFPI + others*** = CD matrix code. If you want a solid archive split ring codes and IFPI codes or call everything matrix.

If you look better some CD have some numbers like "1 2" written very small.

My patch requests thread
--------------------------------
  • Registered: 2006-12-24
  • Posts: 3,847

King of Fighters '95, The (J) (Track 04-05, 11-12, 14-15, 17-18, 20-21, 24-25)
http://redump.org/disc/1874/
SUB ---> T-3101G
Analysis: Actual pauses are exactly 150 sectors, but according to the Q-channel, those pregaps are 149 sectors long. So, it's just another case of the incorrect mastering smile

Should be redumped/fixed:

ClockWerx (J) (Track 05-06) - http://redump.org/disc/5088/ - iR0b0t's dump
O-chan no Oekaki Logic (J) (Track 06-07) - http://redump.org/disc/3315/ - p_star's dump, he doesn't have this CD anymore, should be just fixed?
Real Bout Garou Densetsu Special (J) (Track 18-19) - http://redump.org/disc/1747/ - p_star's & asapy's dump, p_star doesn't have this CD anymore (as usual)

Are those 02:02 gaps fine?

Andretti Racing (F) (Track 02-03) - http://redump.org/disc/3811/ - p_star's dump
Cyber Speedway (E) (Track 03-04, 06-07, 12-13, 13-14, 16-17, 18-19) - http://redump.org/disc/5196/ - iR0b0t's dump
NHL All-Star Hockey (E) (lots of) - http://redump.org/disc/3820/ - p_star's dump
Road & Track Presents - The Need for Speed (E) (Track 02-03, 09-10, 10-11) - http://redump.org/disc/4815/p_star's dump
Sega Rally Championship (U) (Track 05-06) - http://redump.org/disc/4892/ - p_star's & iR0b0t's dump
Thunderhawk 2 - Firestorm (G) (lots of) - http://redump.org/disc/5194/ - iR0b0t's dump (this one also has a weird single 02:01 gap, should also be checked)

Track02 pregap should be verified, if it's similar to the Gunbird case or not.

Kyuutenkai(J) - http://redump.org/disc/3716/ - Rocknroms' dump
Whizz (J) - http://redump.org/disc/5164/ - Rocknroms' dump

  • From: Hyrule
  • Registered: 2008-01-16
  • Posts: 1,440

Added.

F1ReB4LL can you check your KoF96 dump track02? Probably it could have garbage in pregap (in this case has to be fixwed) or data or can be completely different from other dump. I added a remotediff in my patch request thread also for this track.

My patch requests thread
--------------------------------
  • From: Hyrule
  • Registered: 2008-01-16
  • Posts: 1,440

O-chan no Oekaki Logic (J) (Track 06-07) - http://redump.org/disc/3315/ - p_star's dump, he doesn't have this CD anymore, should be just fixed?

We can fix it waiting for a new dump for confirmation, he has the dump? Because there's no data around for this game.

My patch requests thread
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  • Registered: 2006-12-24
  • Posts: 3,847

(Updated my previous post again).

  • From: Hyrule
  • Registered: 2008-01-16
  • Posts: 1,440

I will check the games tomorrow. About Whizz it should be ok, I wrote it in a previous post.

About dumps that cannot be redumped, a owner can make a copy (or mount it on DT... or use the method you used for Gunbird) and check if these sectors are 0x02 .

PS: Remember to check Kof96 wink

Edit: F1ReB4LL, some games you have listed above may be checked, but serpentine pregap is not a hint for EAN sectors. Normally EAN sectors (as it's found until now) reports 0 sec pregap on PerfectRip. I will put this games in a separate list.

My patch requests thread
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